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Karma + Poppy Dual Jungle Team

WOB Silas September 19, 2011 User blog:WOB Silas

So User:Captain Montilla and I recently started playing a few co-ops dual-jungling, just for the fun of it (to be honest, we've only done 2 so far). Following this train of thought, I stumbled on an idea; a way to take advantage of the immense ganking potential of one champion and the surprisingly good jungling of another. As we all know, Poppy Poppy is an AMAZING ganker, but her jungling is less than ideal, whereas (some of you may not know this, but...) Karma Karma is actually great at the jungling part of things while being pretty terrible on the ganking side. Throw them together and add the fact that Karma Karma and Poppy Poppy already have amazing synergy with each other (if you want to ask me about that, I'll explain it), and it actually seemed like a borderline viable idea. So I asked Montilla and Horathiel (the friend we were playing with) if they wanted to try it.

Dear god it was fun. Very wonky (we have a LOT of kinks to work out), but dear god it was fun. With the kinks worked out though, I could see it becoming something pretty amazing.

Of course, there are a few issues with it:

1)As with all dual jungle comps, this is more than likely going to leave one (if not two) lanes 1v2. This limits the champions you can choose for those lanes.

2) Zilean Zilean is pretty much required on a dual jungle team. If you don't get Zilean Zilean, you need to take xp quints, or you won't hit 3 after you clear your jungle. This isn't too bad, because he's not a terrible 1v2 from what I can tell, but it leaves us with issue 3.

3) Poppy Poppy + Karma Karma + Zilean Zilean = potentially way too much magic damage. This not only forces Poppy Poppy to focus more on AD instead of giving her her usual versatility, it also limits your other choices once again.

However, I think the benefits will outweigh the costs. Beyond the obvious, there are the following:

1) Three solo lanes. This potentially means MUCH faster levelling (especially with Heightened Learning.png Heightened Learning) and no bickering over gold. As long as you don't get too zoned (which the ridiculously amazing ganks should help with), you'll be walking on sunshine as a laner.

2) Zilean Zilean and Karma Karma together on a team with Poppy Poppy. I don't know if you've noticed, but Poppy Poppy is pretty ridiculous at low health, especially when she's moving at the speed of light. Both Zilean Zilean AND Karma Karma are incredibly good at enabling her to do these things. More on this later.

3) Karma Karma and Poppy Poppy are both quite used to not getting a ton of gold early game, and Poppy Poppy's quite used to getting zoned. Even the small amount of gold and experience they have to share in the jungle is therefore potentially more than they're used to, and they don't need a ton get get going. They can start dominating the game after they land a few ganks and get a couple items.

So, considering how good it looks to me, I tried to come up with options for the other two champions, so here you go:

AD: Tryndamere Tryndamere or Olaf Olaf. Yes, that leaves us with no ranged AD. I recognize that may be a problem. Against a heavy CC team, Olaf Olaf would probably be an absolute necessity for this reason (otherwise all of your primary damage output could be reliably shut down). The reason I chose them over, say, Ashe Ashe, though, was because they both also benefit IMMENSELY from the movement speed and security-at-low-health that Karma Karma and Zilean Zilean provide. Zilean Zilean and Karma Karma both buffing Poppy Poppy all the time would just be overkill, and this gives the other something productive to do in the meantime. Also, they are INCREDIBLY scary when fed and no one in their right mind would stack magic resistance neglecting armor against a decent one, so we either punish the enemy for building against the core of our comp or force them to build otherwise. It's a win-win.

Probably the main issue with this is that those two tend to prefer the jungle over the lane. In order to avoid getting zoned 1v2, they'd probably be forced to go mid if the enemy team doesn't have a jungler (which is definitely possible, but it's wonky and requires a very skilled player). If the enemy team DOES have a jungler, of course, they can go top and potentially have a ball.

Some other options from feedback, (main issues with these are they're less awesome with Zilean + Karma, but they could certainly work): Irelia Irelia, Caitlyn Caitlyn. The latter more for those of you that can't handle not having a ranged AD.

Tank: Alistar Alistar would probably be my number one choice. Galio Galio or Maokai Maokai were the first two that came to mind; anyone you can reliably 1v2 with that is a REAL TANK (no Mordekaiser HUEHUEHUEHUEHUE, sorry) could work. The issue here is of course their lack of AD damage. A more AD-oriented tank like Rammus Rammus could potentially be better, but Rammus Rammus in a 1v2 lane is a sad, sad thing to behold. In a draft pick game where you see the enemy has a jungler, you could pick someone like Singed Singed who's capable of running a 1v1 well, but in Blind pick I think you'd be best off picking someone who can somewhat reliably 1v2 (and as a final note, preferably someone who can reliably interrupt. With my current comp so far, the only interrupt is Heroic Charge.png Heroic Charge, so that could be a problem. Alistar Alistar, Maokai Maokai or Cho'Gath Cho (I'll admit I forgot to mention him, he'd probably work very well too) would likely top Galio Galio for this reason alone (to be honest, it's probably my biggest conceptual problem with tank galio overall :/)).

Other options from feedback: Gragas Gragas (note he does have the same problem as Galio in terms of interrupts, albeit on a shorter cooldown. I don't know tank Gragas that well but it could be interesting, and ganking that lane would be great) and Jarvan IV Jarvan IV (good 1v2, good AD damage, might open up a little more room in the AD spot for a less damage-oriented champion, but depending on the new pick for AD, he might have to be really good at landing his knockup).

Any questions? Complaints? Comments? Qualms? Anyone want to help us improve our methods, or join us in this epic endeavor? :D

EDIT: Some credit to Stonewall008's Nunu + Shen double jungle video. I'd link to it, but it's apparently been removed :/. Just so you know though, this kind of thing has been done, sort of.

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